Another question on preserving (PC) meat

[childoftheearth]

Hi All,

My only resource as the moment is the little booklet that came with my pressure canner. It gives instructions and processing times/pressure for meat in pieces (e.g. stewing cubes) and for mince, but does not mention whole pieces.

I would like to try a piece of corned silverside, can anyone guide me on if/how this should be processed.

Thanks
Elaine

[minnie]

Hi Elaine,

My first thought is the size the bottle would need to be to have a 'whole' silverside??

It would take some time to process the weight, that's for sure.

Vicki

[childoftheearth]

Hi Vikki

The piece I want to try is a little under a kilogram and I'm fairly confident that it will fit in a # 31 FV jar when it is trimmed.

The booklet that came with the canner indicates 75 mins @11lbs pressure for meat pieces or mince, but I don't know if this would be sufficient for the heat to penetrate to the centre of a whole piece, or even if that is necessary given that the centre can't have been contaminated with any "nasties".
If anyone can recommend a book with good coverage of meat processing I would be very grateful.

I'm getting a copy of Digby Law's Pickle book today ("Books for Cooks" got it in for me) on the recommendation of someone on the forum (Kathleen?). I'm very excited! (No wonder my daughter keeps telling me I need a life!)

Cheers
Elaine

[Shadowgirlau]

I think that recommedation came from Vicki actually as although I also love that book Vicki often sings it praises while I am not as "loud" about it

Now about the meat, I really am not so sure about that size. I started my canning using the book by Carol Costenbader called The Big Book of Preserving the Harvest. Shall have to go and dig it out and see what she says about meats and this size piece when it comes to canning.

Kathleen

[Glyn]

Hi,
Have a look on http://www.backwoodshome.com/advice/ask ... nline.html
The Feb 14 issue 2007 has some details - there are quite a few articles in the other issues too.
Do you corn your own silver side?
Cheers Glyn

[minnie]

Hi Elaine,

Now it was Kathleen that put me onto the Digby Laws book, and I am a fan.


Vicki

[Shadowgirlau]

Hi Elaine,
I have looked in the couple of books which I have out regarding the canning of large pieces of meat and also asked friends who can about doing this. I shall post in the results and answers here now.
Kris in Florida said -
We general call "silverside" bottom round, here in central FL never heard
it called silverside before..(had to look that one up hehehehe)
I have canned 1-2 pound chunks of meat that fit in pint or quart size jars and it turned out ok but I prefer it in chunks cause that is how I use it. I would not be able to tell you if it would work for whatever applications you would use it for as I don't know those.
I would not cut the meat so large that there is no room in the jars...I also would probably add some broth to it as the meat is so lean it will be fairly dry after canning...
But the benefit is that these tougher meats generally do well in canning due to the long cooking time (if you add some broth, so it is something like braising)
Unfortunately she didn't tell me a time for processing her pieces of meat this way, so I looked in my other books.

CANNED ROAST

Begin by cutting the beef, veal, lamb, mutton, pork, chevon, or venison into chunks, and then bake or roast them until they're well browned (but not done through) ... or brown them in a small amount of fat. After adding salt to suit your taste, pack the hot meat into your preheated jars and cover the meat with hot gravy or broth, leaving an inch of headspace. Adjust the caps, and process the jars at 10 pounds of pressure (an hour and 15 minutes for pints, an hour and 30 minutes for quarts). (Ball Blue Book)
Different kinds and cuts of meat may require variations in temperature and pressure. Consult tested, USDA approved and current recipes for all canning, as most food-borne illness are the result of improper handling and storage of food.




Hot Pack
Precook meat until rare by roasting, stewing, or browning in a small amount of fat. If desired add 2 teaspoons of salt per quart to the jar. Fill jars with meat, add boiling broth, meat drippings, water, or tomato juice, leaving 1-inch headspace.

Raw Pack
If desired, add 2 teaspoons of salt per quart. Fill with raw meat pieces, leaving 1-inch headspace. Do not add liquid. Adjust lids and process
Ball Blue Book (Vol. 1) (1995). Published by Ball/Alltrista Corporation, Muncie, Indiana.

The general consensus seems to be and I would agree with this, is - Bacterial growth is hindered by the acid in food ... and meat is very low in acid. Worse yet, certain harmful bacteria thrive where natural acidity is low, and these cannot readily be destroyed at the boiling point of 212 IF. To can meat, therefore, you must superheat it to 240F, which means it must always be processed by pressure canning... not with boiling water baths
Be aware, too, that the flavor and texture of any canned meat will depend upon the breed, the feed, and the manner in which the animal was handled at the time-and immediately after-it was killed.

From what I have read it is better to brown your meat first and cook it until it is rare but hot before you can it.

Hope this is of some help to you
Kathleen

[childoftheearth]

Hi Everybody and thanks for your input,

Glyn, I had already seen the article in Backwoods Home, following on from your earlier post in which you gave the link. I always enjoy reading your posts, you often seem to pose the questions I've been thinking about!

Kathleen, your American correspondent seems to have echoed the information in the PC instruction booklet. It might just be a matter of terminology. I would call a large, rough dice "chunks", but based on your correspondent's experience it seems as though my ~1 kg piece of meat is an American "chunk".

I'll just give it a go with one piece and open it after a couple of weeks to see how it goes. I picked up a copy of the USDA Complete Guide to Canning and Preserving while I was at Books for Cooks yesterday. It doesn't give much more information than the booklet, other than to confirm that botulism is confined to food surfaces, so I think the risk is from spoilage which would be apparent when the jar is opened (or even before).

Thanks for the link for the poultry farm. I have emailed Shani about the eggs/chooks. If the promptness or her reply is any indication, she will be a very good person to deal with.

Vikki, I'm happy to share the credit (or blame!) for recommending the Digby Law book between you and Kathleen. I'm keen to try the Peach Chutney, but I would like to hear if you or Kathleen have any particular favourites to recommend.

Thanks again All,
Cheers,
Elaine

[Shadowgirlau]

Actually Elaine, not quite.
Sorry I have taken so long to get back with anymore input but have been away all day. My sisterinlaw is in a bad way and so hubby has to go home (to NZ) which means we have been off in town today organizing air tickets etc.
Another American canner has posted a reply to my request for input with regards to large pieces of meat (in 2lb lots) which is roughly our 1kg or just a little more size. Here is what she replied to me -

Hi Kathleen,

I hope you’re the original poster; if not, please disregard this reply. And if what I’ve said below is something you’re already aware of, I apologize.

I think there might potentially be a problem PC’ing meat in pieces larger than “chunks.”

The universities here in the US that did the research (on what it takes to keep food at the required 240 degrees for the necessary amount of time to kill the test organisms) found that the density of the food had a direct impact on the time required. That’s why they recommend PC’ing meat in chunks.

The larger a piece of meat, the denser, and therefore the longer it would take for the center of the hunk to reach 240 degrees. If one simply processed this hunk for 75 or 90 minutes, there’s no way for a home canner to know whether the center was hot enough, long enough, to kill any pathogens that might be present, or to destroy the enzymes that cause spoilage. (The USDA processing guidelines don’t include pureed pumpkin for this same reason – pumpkin cubes are OK, but not puree.)

Just my 2 cents’ worth. I’ve canned beef (though not silverside) in chunks, and it was quite passable. I found it tasted better if I browned the chunks first.

Just my opinion, but I hope that helps.

The above reply is actually close to what I had been thinking would be the case myself from all that I had read in the past however I wasn't 100% sure so wanted more input. Hope this helps you

Kathleen

[minnie]

Hi Elaine,

I've made the zucchini (yellow button squash) pickled... but did yellow and green, so changed things a little.

Have done Cherry chutney, Apple and Date Chutney, his old fashioned (I think) tomato sauce (but I add a couple of things that Jamie Oliver does too), Worchestershire Sauce, I made other chutney's and off the top of my head can't think what they were... the Apple and Date is quick and easy so when lost for time it's a good one.

I really want to do the Ritz Chutney (with Jam melon, have the seeds just not planted).

If I sat down with the book I'm sure I'd remember others... at the moment I've lost a book (folder with lots of recipes collected from various sources) and going nuts trying to find it... DH emptied a shelf and I have one of the folders but the more recent one has gone... You've got to watch men when they decide to move things!

Vicki